Re: First appearance MiG-15s

[<AMPSOne@aol.com>]

Mark is "spot on" in his description of Russian sources. 

One thing which has come out in recent days is the method many pilots used 
later in the air war to "validate" claims. 

If the attacker was a Sabre and the victim a MiG, if it began to pour grey 
smoke from the engine, the Sabre pilot counted it as a kill and it was 
apparently validated by FEAF. However, the MiG's Nene derived engine could 
apparently have three or four combustion chambers shot out (which is what 
caused the grey smoke) and still get home safely.

If the attacker was a MiG and the victim a Sabre, if the Sabre began spouting 
black smoke from its engine, the Soviets counted it as either a kill or 
probable kill. However, when firewalled, all the Sabre pilots note that the 
GE engine in the F-86 always poured out black smoke. (For those not familiar 
with this quirk, see the takeoff scenes in the film "The Hunters" and you'll 
see what they meant.) 

Bottom line: both sides "cooked the books" and it is still not easy to sort 
out. Naboka's book is the clearest recitation of the Podol'sk materials, and 
has the advantage of providing times and locations of fights and claims 
(something which the official USAF listing, available from Maxwell on their 
web site, does not.)

Even when you take the "1059" list from DPMO, claims as noted in the Naboka 
book and other memoirs, US pilots' autobiographies, and official USAF lists 
and reports and try and run them together, the results are very, very muddy. 
Case in point: Futrell cites a total of 1,198 USAF personnel killed in action 
in Korea, and the latest claim on the AFM web site is now only 379. Raymond 
Cheung's listing I cited the other night has over 925 names on it of KIA/MIA 
BNR personnel. Sigh.

Cookie Sewell
AMPS