Re: Better trained?

[Joe Brennan <jbren1@optonline.net>]

In Korea accidents claimed literally 100's of aircraft, about 50% of all
those lost by the US. Today some of the debate on the cause of US losses in
Korea is caused by disbelief so many accidents could have happened. But I
believe they did. That was the technology of the time combined with the
operating conditions, as against the best training, and best efforts, of
aircrew and maintenance personal possible in the circumstances.

I believe it's the same now. Helicopters in wartime safety conditions don't
have the accident rate of commercial airliners or even of modern fixed wing
military a/c. It seems well demonstrated in many recent conflicts.

So far the US/UK fixed wing force, land and carrier based lost 1 a/c (to an
accident) in 6000 sorties. The expected accidental losses in Korea would
have been many times as much. Carrier a/c in the winter season had sustained
accidental loss rates as high as 1/2% (30 accidental losses in that many
sorties) and even land based you'd have expected half a dozen or a dozen by
now at least in the Korean situation. Does that mean those were bad airmen?
no, does any accident at all in this campaign mean that, also no. What's
your standard for expected or acceptable accident rates?

Joe
----- Original Message -----
From: "swan" <swan@haysco.net>
To: <KOREAN-WAR-L@listproc.cc.ku.edu>
Sent: Monday, March 24, 2003 10:38 AM
Subject: Re: Better trained?


> Ed, the point is this: I heard the men of the 24th and 25th Inf. Divisions
> referred to here as 'garritroopers." These men were outnumbered and
> out-gunned by a very determined enemy. They suffered tremendous losses,
but
> still they hung  in there. Many of the causalities in Gulf War II seem to
be
> the result of accidents and mistakes. I don't know if these are because of
> poor leadership or poor training, but it seems that our troops in this war
> are proving to be their own worst enemies. I think that the North Koreans
> might be making the same observations.
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Ed Evanhoe" <evanhoe@arbuckleonline.com>
> To: <KOREAN-WAR-L@listproc.cc.ku.edu>
> Sent: Monday, March 24, 2003 6:54 AM
> Subject: Re: Better trained?
>
>
> > At 06:10 AM 3/24/2003 -0600, you wrote:
> > >There was some discussion here about the "poorly trained" troops during
> > >the early days of the Korean War. Gulf War II is producing numerous
> tragic
> > >comedies of error. Who is training the helicopter pilots now?
> >
> > Not sure what your point is about "who is training helicopter pilots"
but
> > every war has its share of what you refer to as  "comedies of error."
> >
> > Ed
> > Ed Evanhoe, PO Box 916, Antlers, OK, 74523-0916
> > Life member: Special Forces & Special Operations Associations
> > Author: DARKMOON: Eighth Army Special Operations in the Korean War
> > Web site:  http://www.korean-war.com
> >
>